On LQT archives


There are some hundreds pages which were mass-added to LiquidThreads without a previous history and are now empty archives, if you're interested. It's rather easy to find them with a query, see e.g. quarry:query/9157 which can be easily improved; where a wikitext page existed before, it would be better to move it back into its place. Nemo 08:55, 20 April 2016 (UTC)Reply

A tremendous time!



I am glad to announce the official creation of the user group for Wiktionaries! You mentioned a polite interests for this great adventure and so, here it is!

the Wiktionary Tremendous Group

You're welcome to participate to this brand new collective exploration of the lexicoworld by helping to translate in German, find a fancy logo, contact people or mention places where the announce have to be made. There is still a lot to do, only main pages are there. Soon, I will translate some cool stuff we made in French: 2015 summary, skills list, banner and more. I also plan to visit every community so help welcome! Spread the word Noé (talk) 00:08, 21 July 2016 (UTC)Reply

RDF Julian Gregorian conversion


I observe you seem to be the sole contributor to mediawiki-extensions-Wikibase/repo/includes/Rdf/JulianDateTimeValueCleaner.php

To test this code, I adapted it to a php script that could be run from the Windows command line, and found that the earliest supported date is January 2, 4713 BC. Since the behavior of php functions such as cal_to_jd and jdtogregorian is not documented with respect to ancient dates, may I suggest the earliest supported date be documented somewhere (perhaps as a source code comment). Jc3s5h (talk) 19:02, 18 September 2016 (UTC)Reply

I'm very interested in date related code, but in this case it was not written by me. The fact that the RDF export just fails and does not export anything for Julian dates that exceed the range PHP's date conversion functions support is, in my opinion, a bug that should be reported on Phabricator and fixed. I created phab:T146356. --Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE) 09:54, 22 September 2016 (UTC)Reply
Thanks. Jc3s5h (talk) 23:38, 23 September 2016 (UTC)Reply

User:Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE)/common.js


Please do not delete this page, but User:Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE)/common.js. Thanks!

Done --Cronolio (talk) 07:41, 7 April 2020 (UTC)Reply

Timestamps in Flow


If you need to compare the exact timestamps for comments in Flow, then you can see all of them, in the traditional format, in the thread's history page: https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:Vm8tt946wnwwle6n&action=history

And now I'm curious how often you actually need to know how many minutes apart various old comments are. (Please ping me.) Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 16:47, 16 May 2020 (UTC)Reply

@Whatamidoing: I don't think it's the point if I "actually need" it. Displaying the same "4 months ago" all over the place when the whole thread is that old is not only redundant, it appears broken. Yea, displaying "2 minutes ago" feels like it makes a lot of sense. Same for "2 hours ago". Possibly also "2 days ago", even if that's already heavily ambiguous. (E.g. are 1.5 days and 2.49 days both "2 days ago"? And if so, why? These are clearly a full day apart. Why do we want to discard this?) If it's more than a week, let the user decide what information they need. Maybe they want to know if a post was written in the middle of the night? (Needs the hour.) Maybe they want to know the day of the week? (Needs the full date.) We don't know. So we shouldn't discard anything. --Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE) 15:55, 20 May 2020 (UTC)Reply
No information is being discarded. If you need to know the exact date or hour for a single message, then you can hover over it. If you need to know whether all of the comments in an older conversation happened in minutes vs hours vs days, then you can check the page's history and see them all. You might be able to claim that some information is slightly "hidden", but all the information is still present. (By the way, our New Zealand editors insist that you can't determine the day of the week, as "Wednesday at 16:00 UTC" is Thursday on their side of the world, so the day-of-the-week use case is invalid.)
"Let the user decide" doesn't help you determine a default setting. Unless you want to force every user to set their prefs before they're allowed to read the page, you must have a default setting. The Flow folks chose relative time as their initial default. Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 19:43, 20 May 2020 (UTC)Reply
@Whatamidoing, I honestly don't know how to respond to this. Despite originally saying you are "curious", this doesn't sound like you are interested in a conversation. Do you understand the issue in the example where every single post in a thread is marked as being written "4 months ago"? --Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE) 08:59, 12 June 2020 (UTC)Reply
No, I don't understand why that's an issue. For my own editing, knowing that the entire conversation happened about four months ago is almost always more important to me than knowing whether the individual comments were minutes/hours/days apart. Is your experience different?
This reply is about 10 hours after your most recent comment. Four months from now, what practical difference do you think that fact will that make to anyone who reads it? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 19:00, 12 June 2020 (UTC)Reply
@Whatamidoing, it makes a difference if a reply was written within minutes, but the next one weeks later. Furthermore, I have never seen this being done to such an extreme. Twitter, for example, stops at "24h" and starts showing the date (e.g. "Jun 10"). But I'm not sure if continuing to argue about this is worth my time. What will happen if I manage to convince you? --Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE) 19:36, 12 June 2020 (UTC)Reply
Nothing to Flow, because that's not under active development. But I might be able to prevent similar problems in the future, if I understood what difference it makes – four months later – if the first reply is written within minutes and the second reply was written one week later. I hear that you say it makes a difference; I want to know what the difference is. For example, does knowing the amount of time in between the comments help you decide whether to reply? Does it change what you write? Also, how often does it have that effect? Do you check multiple timestamps in conversations every day, every week, once a month, once a year? Whatamidoing (WMF) (talk) 01:36, 13 June 2020 (UTC)Reply
I don't think I can continue a conversation like this. Being questioned like this is exhausting. Just open any random app or website that is about conversations. Twitter stops at "24h" and then shows the date. Slack, WhatsApp, and whatnot all stop "yesterday" and then show the date. Do you know why Flow was such a disaster? Because it made people feel like there is somebody deciding for them what they need and what not, without asking them. Suppressing the date is part of that. --Thiemo Kreuz (WMDE) 08:57, 16 June 2020 (UTC)Reply



Dear Thiemo Kreuz,

This is an official message by the Code of Conduct committee. We received a report about one of your recent Gerrit patch reviews which we agree was written in a condescending and unnecessarily hostile tone. Please use a civil tone when writing comments to other committers even if you are making a technical point that, to you, seems obvious.

This is the second time we send you a note of this regard, please have in mind that persistent violations of the Code of Conduct may result in a block or ban.

Sincerely, --TechConductCommittee (talk) 17:45, 6 July 2020 (UTC)Reply

Hi TechConductCommittee. Which Gerrit patch review specifically? Please provide a URL. --MZMcBride (talk) 08:02, 7 July 2020 (UTC)Reply